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'78 R80/7: Get running again questions

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David Liechty
(@12771)
Posts: 14
Active Member
Topic starter
 

Hi everyone. I’m in a bit of a conundrum and hoping to get some sage advice. I joined ABC in 2015, a few years after I bought my r80/7 - but marriage, moving to NYC, and then my wife coming down with cancer and passing away on me sort of took me out of the loop for a while.

My bike has been stored in my brother’s barn in Downingtown, PA for six or seven years, and hasn’t been started in at least five. (We ran it dry, and it’s primarily been on the center stand, so I hope there isn’t gunk in the carburetors.)

Since my wife passed, I’ve moved out to Utah so my stepdaughter can be with family (that’s where we’re from originally). When we got ready to move everything from NYC to Utah, after my wife passed, I turned my attention back to my bike, and renewed my membership here.

Visually, everything seems to be as it was on my bike, but the front brake caliper seized last fall and today we had issues getting it into and out of neutral. I know I need to follow the “What to do with a new-to-you bike” thread on here, since it’s been sitting so long, and I will as soon as I can, to make sure everything is in order before I fire it up.

I’m in PA this weekend, but heading back to Utah tomorrow. I want to get my bike out to Utah so I can work on it, but I don’t know how feasible this is in its current condition. Does anyone have experience with shipping a bike cross-country? Any recommendations on a shipper? Could it be shipped with the front caliper seized as it is? I haven’t found any airhead-specific guide to unsticking calipers online, but I assume it’s something I could do on my own.

Any advice on this would be greatly appreciated. I’ve considered having Hermy’s in Port Clinton come fetch my bike and look it over, but they couldn’t guarantee a vintage ride like mine would even get a look before summer is over. So, I think I’d rather have it near-to-hand in Utah if that’s at all possible.

Many thanks in advance for any thoughts and suggestions. Glad to be back as part of the community.

[Mods changed title to aid future searches]

 
Posted : 06/15/2019 02:23
Richard W
(@wobbly)
Posts: 2545
Member
 

First, allow me to echo Scot's sentiments on the loss of your spouse. That is indeed sad. My sincerest condolences both to you and your family.

There are many reasons the front hydraulic brake might seize on the brake rotor, making it impossible to roll the bike. However....
• The most common reason is the internal collapse of the flexible brake hose. Absolutely no outward visible signs are given when this happens. The hose cannot be repaired.

(This type failure is one of the big reasons to replace all flexible hoses with "stainless steel brake hoses", because the inner PTFE ("Teflon") hose is not susceptible to DOT4 brake fluid, which is a VERY caustic substance. There are numerous vendors for the newer style hose, Spiegler is probably the most popular. )

You can diagnose the hose failure 95% of the time by simply cracking open the 11mm (7/16 inch) bleeder nipple on the caliper. If the pressure is relieved and the bike miraculously start rolling, then it's most likely a hose failure. If everything is fine until the brake lever is pulled again, then the failed hose is acting as a one-way valve and that's the final part of the diagnosis.

Two warnings when you do this: 1) Use a box-end spanner to open the nipple. 2) The DOT4 fluid that comes out is VERY caustic and will eat the paint off anything it touches. Wash it off of everything with hot soapy water.

• The distant second place reason is that the brake fluid has solidified inside the hydraulic system and a complete disassembly of every part is required. This strange property of DOT4 is why BMW wants you to install new fluid once a year.

If this is the case, then you can hopefully separate the pucks far enough to get the bike to roll with pry bars or some such.

► I have used Forward Air and it was a 3 of 10 experience. You have to take the bike to their warehouse at a time they choose, where you unload the bike and strap it inside a special motorcycle container with your straps and then seal the container with your padlocks. When the bike arrives at their facility, you go down to their facility and reverse the process. They do not assist in any way, other than point to the container. You have to get the bike back on your trailer by yourself. Additionally, Forward Air does not have facilities in every city, so you may end up driving 75+ miles to both depots. That's a lot of work. They may also assign you a drop off or pickup time in a part of town you most definitely don't want to visit at 11:30PM. But my bike arrived in perfect condition.

Their are also independent drivers that come to your home and load the bike, then deliver it to your destination. I'd ask around for one of those guys. It's totally worth an extra $200 to get this door-to-door delivery.

Hope this helps.

Owning an old Airhead is easy.
Keeping an old Airhead running great is the true test.

 
Posted : 06/15/2019 18:52
David Liechty
(@12771)
Posts: 14
Active Member
Topic starter
 

Hi Wobbly and Scot,

Thank you very much for your kind words and your advice. I appreciate both very much.

My brother and I were able to get the front wheel loose before I left last week - so it isn't stuck pads, which is good. We were also able to get it started and keep it running for a while. Gas leaked out of either the fuel lines or the carbs on both sides, though, so I know I'm in for some work there.

I opted to go with a company called AA Motorcycle Shipping - they had mixed reviews, but were able to schedule a pick up before my brother left on vacation last week. The others needed at least 10 days. My bike is somewhere west of Ohio as of right now, and headed my way. I get a little jolt of excitement every time I think of it - like a little kid anticipating Christmas. Love that bike and can't wait to get it road-worthy again.

Will post more when I get the bike here and start fixing the brakes and looking over everything else.

Thanks again. Very much appreciated.

Best,

David

 
Posted : 06/25/2019 14:30
David Liechty
(@12771)
Posts: 14
Active Member
Topic starter
 

My bike arrived safe and sound, and I ordered some new brake cables. Will keep updating as things progress. Thanks again.

 
Posted : 07/06/2019 02:16
Richard W
(@wobbly)
Posts: 2545
Member
 

Congratulations "kid at Christmas" !!

May the feeling never end !

Owning an old Airhead is easy.
Keeping an old Airhead running great is the true test.

 
Posted : 07/06/2019 20:51
David Liechty
(@12771)
Posts: 14
Active Member
Topic starter
 

So, a month has passed, I’ve purchased new Spiegler brake cables, and I’m discovering that the realities of being a single dad don’t allow for much extra time to wrench on a motorcycle ... so I’m in the same spot I was a month ago. Given the state of my bike and all that may need to be done to it, I’ve decided to let someone else do the wrenching right now. I’ve located a reputable airhead mechanic in SLC and will pass it off to him next week. Thanks very much again for your advice.

 
Posted : 08/30/2019 12:14
David Liechty
(@12771)
Posts: 14
Active Member
Topic starter
 

Hi again. Ron at Bavarian Motorcycle Workshop took a look at my bike. Apparently time has not been kind. There is a large pit in the left cylinder and various other issues (MC shot, front brake piston seized, tank almost rusted through, drive shaft boot needs to be replaced, rebuild carbs) that he can see right now.

I don’t know what to do. I’m emotionally invested in this bike, but fixing these will be three grand - and he doesn’t know what else he will find along the way or after it’s road-worthy.

Any thoughts?

 
Posted : 09/06/2019 13:26
Richard W
(@wobbly)
Posts: 2545
Member
 

I don’t know what to do. I’m emotionally invested in this bike, but fixing these will be three grand - and he doesn’t know what else he will find along the way or after it’s road-worthy.

Any thoughts?

You're not thinking correctly. It will be $3000 if Ron does the work. It will be several hundred dollars spread over a year if YOU do the work.

I suggest that YOU do the work.

Owning an old Airhead is easy.
Keeping an old Airhead running great is the true test.

 
Posted : 09/06/2019 15:57
David Liechty
(@12771)
Posts: 14
Active Member
Topic starter
 

You're totally right. Getting my bike back today. Will get to work on the brakes immediately.

 
Posted : 09/10/2019 13:27
Richard W
(@wobbly)
Posts: 2545
Member
 

Start on the brakes. Have you ever rebuilt a master cyl ? It's actually very easy. Disassemble the m/c and scrub all the parts in hot soapy water. Allow them to dry in the sun or put a hair dryer on them. Wrap a piece of 400 grit emery cloth around a short length of 1/4 dowel, then put the dowel in a drill motor chuck. Just go round and round, while you go in/out on the bore. If you can get a sparkling clean bore with no pitting, then it can be rebuilt with the addition of a rebuild kit.

While you wait on the kit, you can paint the outside of the iron cylinder, and scrub out the reservoir. Compressed air really helps blow out debris.

With only 2 pieces, the calipers are even simpler. Compressed air will pop out the piston(s). Scrub out all the old crap that accumulates inside, again with 400 grit and hot soapy water. You won't require new seals if the old ones weren't leaking.

Sometimes really old DOT4 will build up a thick, crusty varnish. The 400 grit will get rid of all that. When everything is clean, coat the bare surfaces in new brake fluid before re-assembly.

Easy as that.

PS. If the m/c was leaking there will be missing paint on the frame. Also clean up the gelatin left by the brake fluid off of the electrical contacts just below the m/c. (Again with hot soapy water.) Brake fluid in any form will cause terminal corrosion and poor electrical connectivity.

Owning an old Airhead is easy.
Keeping an old Airhead running great is the true test.

 
Posted : 09/11/2019 00:50
David Liechty
(@12771)
Posts: 14
Active Member
Topic starter
 

I've never rebuilt anything in my life. I'm an absolute newbie at this. I plan to take the front brake assembly apart today. I'll clean it up and see how the master cylinder looks.

 
Posted : 09/11/2019 12:37
Richard W
(@wobbly)
Posts: 2545
Member
 

I've never rebuilt anything in my life.

Welcome to the adventure ! 😛

When everything is painted and back together, I find it is much easier to fill the system from the bottom. This chases the air out in a "natural" way. Otherwise when filling from the top you have fluid running down, while air is trying to go up. That can be very frustrating. Filling the system from the bottom can be done with a $30 professional fluid pump, or an $8 hobby oil can. I use the latter. Of course, it's dedicated to brake fluid only.

I expect you'll be buying some tools along the way too. One of the first ones you'll need is a set of "Inside/Outside snap ring pliers" to get the plunger out of the m/c. Looks Like This

Hope this helps.

Owning an old Airhead is easy.
Keeping an old Airhead running great is the true test.

 
Posted : 09/11/2019 23:04
David Liechty
(@12771)
Posts: 14
Active Member
Topic starter
 

I had only a little time today to work on the bike, and found that I didn’t have an 11mm wrench in my tool kit (some of its in storage) ... so I didn’t get very far.

This is what I see with the m/c. I’m assuming the reddish bit is rust and not leakage, since I can see no paint missing from the frame. Also, there doesn’t seem to be any buildup on the underlying electrical.

Would this much rust on the exterior itself bring into question the integrity of the m/c?

 
Posted : 09/12/2019 01:13
Richard W
(@wobbly)
Posts: 2545
Member
 

I had only a little time today to work on the bike, and found that I didn’t have an 11mm wrench in my tool kit... so I didn’t get very far.

In a lot of cases you're going to need 2 wrenches of the main sizes, so just "bite the bullet" and go buy a cheap set of metric combination wrenches, sizes 8mm to 17mm. Combinations have 'open end' on one end and a 'box end' on the other.

This is what I see with the m/c. I’m assuming the reddish bit is rust and not leakage, since I can see no paint missing from the frame. Also, there doesn’t seem to be any buildup on the underlying electrical.

So your m/c is simply weeping or seeping fluid. If it was leaking, then paint would be gone from the top mounting area on the frame tube.

Would this much rust on the exterior itself bring into question the integrity of the m/c?

No. There's no way to know if your m/c is good or not without taking it apart and visually inspecting the bore. In fact, if that is the case, you may not even need the rebuild kit. Cleaning things up and reassembling often brings these things back to 100%. That's the biggest reason to do the work yourself.

But that does not mean your mechanic is a cheat. If he told a customer $15 to rebuild and then an inspection proved it needed a complete $200 m/c, that leads some customers to whine and complain. As a mechanic, it's simply easier to tell the customer $300, and then spring the gift of the lower price on them when they pick the bike up.

Owning an old Airhead is easy.
Keeping an old Airhead running great is the true test.

 
Posted : 09/12/2019 21:27
David Liechty
(@12771)
Posts: 14
Active Member
Topic starter
 

Okay. Got a few new tools. Got some expert help (see photo) and removed the m/c and calipers, pulled them all apart, and cleaned them.

The m/c looks like it might have some pitting. Most of it looks okay, after cleaning it up, but there are a couple of spots lower down. Hopefully you can see them in the attached photo. Significant enough to warrant a new m/c? Should I err on the side of definitely-safe front brakes? I could only find this m/c assembly for about $370 - and a rebuild kit for about $70.

Calipers look good, but I’ll need a new piston for that, because the old one has rust ringing it. Photo also attached. EME has a piston kit for $70.

Also ... maybe this is a big newbie question, but dot 3 or dot 4? The sticker on my frame says dot 3, but Maw BMW sells dot 4, and it seems like that’s what I’ve seen recommended.

Thanks again for your help.

 
Posted : 09/21/2019 04:55
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